Itunes integration, This is the Mac Version

[perrin21]

I do believe that boxee for Mac should conform to the Itunes standard, this way it will be able to keep up with any changes that itunes makes. If i change my metadata to reflect itunes i would expect that Boxee would conform to the same. Macs are all about itunes and apple software. Nearly everybody using a mac with mp3 files will use itunes, its the ipod standard . Boxee, please dont reinvent a perfectly good wheel. When leaving the indexing to the internet, you are leaving our music librarys open to chance, chance that songs will be missed and that info will be incorrect. WHY???? when we should have the correct info in the meta data instead.

Just my opinion.

[aaronbushnell]

I agree. I think that if iTunes is installed on any computer, Boxee should conform to that standard as opposed to holding its own set of data. Pulling it from iTunes like Front Row does would be more beneficial, I think.

[perrin21]

itunes is standard on macs.

[xain09]

I totally agree. Just read the itunes and iphoto database. You don't have anything to process and look up from the internet. Save you guys a lot of work so you can concentrate on the movies, interface and social functions.

EVERYBODY uses iTunes to manage his collection. Use that data. Same goes for iPhoto/Aperture.

I really use Boxee because I have much more detailed movie info and better media support than Front Row but I do have a crippled music/photo collection now while it is all very well organized in fact. Come on guys! (I'm repeating myself here on the forum)

[agentlame]

not everybody... frankly, itunes is garbage.

i think it would be a huge mistake for boxee to default to itunes/iphoto/apple-anything... remember, boxee also runs on linux, and will run on windows.

the option might be a good idea... but not the default.

[perrin21]

I totally agree. Just read the itunes and iphoto database. You don't have anything to process and look up from the internet. Save you guys a lot of work so you can concentrate on the movies, interface and social functions.

EVERYBODY uses iTunes to manage his collection. Use that data. Same goes for iPhoto/Aperture.

I really use Boxee because I have much more detailed movie info and better media support than Front Row but I do have a crippled music/photo collection now while it is all very well organized in fact. Come on guys! (I'm repeating myself here on the forum)

What he said :-)

[Sparks]

I actually know a few friends who got Boxee for Mac and were disappointed that it didn't automatically show things in their iTunes library.

I think Boxee shouldn't restrict itself to iTunes, but that iTunes integration -- ability to point to a daap (iTunes over network) server or read the iTunes library a'la Front Row would make Boxee work 'out of box' for easily 70% of Mac users... would just pick up their media seamlessly.

I.e., don't make this a required default, but do make it a functional option. :)

[snotgiggle]

not everybody... frankly, itunes is garbage.

i think it would be a huge mistake for boxee to default to itunes/iphoto/apple-anything... remember, boxee also runs on linux, and will run on windows.

the option might be a good idea... but not the default.


i totally agree with this. but furthermore, i think there should be options for more than just itunes, perhaps the top three or four podcast aggregators. I use Miro and I don't plan on going back to iTunes because it has horrid resource management and its video playback has really poor black levels. So..perhaps..give users the option to choose between reading metadata from itunes, miro, juice, etc... as many as are reasonable to spend the time coding.

Though I must say, if Boxee DID create their own metadata, which was cohesive and thorough, AND if their rumored auto-downloading and organization of watched/unwatched podcasts was as intuitive as the rest of Boxee, I would no longer need to use Miro or iTunes to download my podcasts and I wouldn't care if Boxee didn't read the metadata from these programs.

[xain09]

It doesn't have to be the default option but it should be an option if you want people to leave Front Row behind.. MOST people use iTunes/iPhoto for their music/photo management. That's just a fact. If you want those people onboard as well, and that is the majority of people once it's out of alpha/beta, we need that option big time. Joe average (or plumber) is not gonna re-tag all of his tracks again. That same Joe is not gonna be happy when all his albums from iPhoto are gone..

[perrin21]

simple simple simple. Remember this is supposed to be for the masses.

Maybe Administrator mode, Advanced mode and User mode would be a good idea.

[agentlame]

simple simple simple. Remember this is supposed to be for the masses.

Maybe Administrator mode, Advanced mode and User mode would be a good idea.

that sounds much less simple. :)

[adecold]

+1 for the itunes/iphoto integration "on mac".. basically most people who use mach have their music properly tagged and sorted. boxee does a terrible job basically because i have lots of international and less known tracks so the identification is always wrong.

adecold

[xain09]

Of course Boxee wants your files to be correctly tagged via an internet database so it can redirect this info to your friends. The whole social aspect is based on this info. That's probably why it starts looking up all your tracks online while they're already correctly tagged from your point of view. This brings us to the next question: Do you use Boxee because you want to share that info also with your friends or do you want Boxee to just list your files correctly asap without bothering if they're tagged "correctly"? Are we losing functionality because of the social factor involved? Just thinking out loud here...

[mweitzel]

Surely this is 'only' an integration issue with XBMC?!? The current XBMC Beta 2 has got an option in Music to import the iTunes library :) which worked fine for me on my MacBook (but not on my AppleTV :(). Once these changes from the Beta 2 are integrated into Boxee the feature should also be available. :D (Haven't noticed anything for videos, pictures, etc. though. :confused:)

[xain09]

The problem with the "integration" in XBMC for the moment is that you have to re-import your whole collection each time you ad something in iTunes.

[wonkeythemonkey]

Not to understate the work involved, but isn't the "iTunes Library.xml" file just a plain text database filled with metadata and pointers to the actual files? When you say that XMBC has to "re-import your whole collection", doesn't that just mean re-reading the XML file? You could even wait until an XMBC restart before re-importing the index.

My iTunes library has about 4700 items and 18.28 GB worth of media, but the library file is only 11 MB. That shouldn't take too long to import at startup, should it? Especially if it's an option that can be enabled or disabled at first launch.

[ert3]

not everybody... frankly, itunes is garbage.

i think it would be a huge mistake for boxee to default to itunes/iphoto/apple-anything... remember, boxee also runs on linux, and will run on windows.

the option might be a good idea... but not the default.

I agree unless your using a mac iTunes is total garbage and what abut Amarok or windows media player.

Sure iTunes integration should be an option (maybe even a selection during the initial startup process) but certainly not the default as its not even a garuntee that all mac users prefer iTunes.

[perrin21]

I agree unless your using a mac iTunes is total garbage and what abut Amarok or windows media player.

Sure iTunes integration should be an option (maybe even a selection during the initial startup process) but certainly not the default as its not even a garuntee that all mac users prefer iTunes.

itunes integration is only wanted for the benefit of the id3 info, and artwork etc. Not the sound quality or UI.

[Ephilei]

I don't know about the XML, but the actual iTunes and iPhoto databases are propietary and unreadable.

Another option would be to include a DAAP client - the protocol iTunes and iPhoto use for sharing media over a network. It's an open standard (RhythmBox on Linux uses it already). Of course that would be read only and you'd have to always run iTunes and iPhoto in the background. And it's awfully inefficient when you think about it. Damn.

[camille leblanc]

TOTALLY AGREE I have 2900 songs already organized in itunes. Where do I find out how to get them...or some playlists into boxee? Do I have to move them to the newly created shared media folder?

[Genjoke]

I am using Boxee or VIDEO MANEGEMENT only.
BOXEE's mp3 manegement sucks! MOST of my songs are wrongly recognized. I keep using iTunes for that.

I think that an OPTION for manual (or idtag imported) metadata is something HIGHLY needed, not only for the music part, but for videos also.

I am seriously thinking about setting a boxee dedicated system for me and another for my mom (who does not know how to use a computer). I dont know yet if those systems will be linuxboxes or mac minis, but 1 thing I know: I will give up the idea if boxee cant import data from the mp3 tags. I live in Brazil, and most of my mother's mp3s are ripped from her old LPs and they are mostly Brazilian songs that CANT BE FOUND on the online databases boxee uses.

That should also be taken in accout: regionality. Will this system (only online metadata) work on non US/UK countries???


By the way, I use apple computers since 1984

[sanXp]

It doesn't have to be the default option but it should be an option if you want people to leave Front Row behind.. MOST people use iTunes/iPhoto for their music/photo management. That's just a fact.

Couldn't agree more.. One of the reasons that stop me from checking "Always Running" is because of the shady music library. It does a better job than Front Row with all the detail but there are still misses. And it takes a hell of a long time to initialize.

That being said I think it would be good if there is a progress bar *somewhere* when it's initializing the library, like the other XBMCs. Or maybe a glowing orb or something. Don't want to sit around for 15 minutes wondering if it's looking for a movie I can't find.. cos maybe it's not looking for it at all.

[jrbrn]

the first thing i noticed when i launched boxee for the first time on my MBP just now is that several albums I have tagged in iTunes came up as different artists/artwork. then i came here and read through everything that has been said.

i think that we should be able to choose the import method. having it automatically scan and import artist / artwork / track info / etc... seems a bit too eager. i would like the ability to specify to the app how i want my media handled. no need for a default automatic process IMO. perhaps you could be presented with a set of options for importing media when you first launch the app and if skipped there... you could be presented with a set of options at each unconfigured media category (when accessed) to ensure that the average user is presented with an "assisted" method of importing their media. sort of like an interview process...

"how would you like boxee to import your videos?"
1. import videos from iTunes
2. scan the following folder for video file types
3. scan the following network location for video file types
4. i don't have any videos to import at this time

and so on through pictures, music, etc...

just my opinion on the matter...

i definitely think we should have the option of importing iTunes library info. this would make the boxee experience simpler for existing iTunes users. we still have to sync our iPods/iPhones ;)

[Bulldog]

i think your right
i don't use itunes but my complete music colection provided with the right coverart the way i like it.
all i want for boxee to do with my music collection is to show it all with the art i have setup (just showing the file "folder.jpg" as art)

as for movies and tv-shows i think boxee is doing a good job so far , not perfect but good. (if you use the right naming for your mediafiles that is)
maybee the ability to use more databases to search for coverart.
for example www.moviemeter.nl (a dutch site) has a lot off coverart aswell.

so yes, i'm for it when it comes to what boxee needs to do with the media you feed it.

[dmax]

another advantage of using iTunes is its integration with airtunes. I routinely broadcast my music through two different airport express units in m home, so that the sound is everywhere.

this is possible using boxee, i would think, but only with using some add on software from the rogueamoeba.com folks. but, since i already have itunes and airtunes, why buy the extra software just to use boxee to play my music?

[MILE]

Hmmh, I hadn't really noticed how badly Boxee seems to deal with music until I read this thread and checked my Music area in Boxee...! :eek:

- of the 400+ albums I have on here it has only listed about 160

- of those 160 albums 8 or so are completely wrong, which makes 5%
(some are weirdly off even, like recognizing Connie Francis as Tyrone Davis and unfortunately there is no way I can manually edit the metadata or any kind of information)

- of the 160 albums it listed it was unable to find cover art for about 20 or so, even though it's mostly mainstream stuff and nothing exotic

So yeah, until that's been worked out i have to rely on iTunes/FrontRow for playing my music .. which kinda sucks, since I was looking for a universal media center of course...

But then again I also know that it is all a work in progress and sooner or later you guys will figure something out, right...?! ;)

:: M ::

[cammons]

another advantage of using iTunes is its integration with airtunes. I routinely broadcast my music through two different airport express units in m home, so that the sound is everywhere.

this is possible using boxee, i would think, but only with using some add on software from the rogueamoeba.com folks. but, since i already have itunes and airtunes, why buy the extra software just to use boxee to play my music?

I agree completely...we have become dependent on airtunes and itunes in our home was one of the main reasons we bought a mac mini for the living room...tried testing the free version of airfoil(to cheap to pay for it) and couldn't get it to jive with Boxee...this would leave me only using Boxee for video content

[harleyquinn]

As a long time user of the big three (Windows, Mac, and *nix), I have tried most of the usual suspects Winamp, (all the Linux players), etc.

Fact is, on the Mac, and coming off of Front Row, and a dedicated Mac Mini HTPC, iTunes is a decent music database.

I would love to see Boxee be able to read "Smart Playlists" or hell, playlists in general. There is also the advent of Genius Playlists.

What would be cool is a menu option in Boxee under Music, Photos, possibly movies/TV, that pops you OUT of Boxee and back to FrontRow for that legacy support.

Just a thought.

P.S. I am optimistic about Songbird!

[earlc008]

I have decided for the time being to play my movies/music/etc in iTunes and to use Boxee for youtube iPlayer etc.

I may consider using just Boxee if the support for iTunes was there. However i agree for the benefit of others it should not be the default there should be other options. One step at a time though and for 2 platforms (mac & apple tv & maybe windows) iTunes integration would be preferred

[djmiller]

Boxee has an evolution ahead and pure iPod+iTunes integration is not its primary aspiration. I see a future where boxee integrates beautifully with the multitude of media sources i use regularly, including my iTunes and Aperture library. Things clearly aren't perfect in this alpha release.

I anxiously await boxee's elegant solution to the many problems they face in this current state and format of media.

But for now, pretty please, iTunes, iPhoto and Aperture libraries only take a few pieces of Cocoa. Think of it as a bridge until we can see the bigger picture down the road.

[Gustovier]

FYI.. PLEX which is also based of xbmc has itunes(even playback of DRM audio!)/iphoto/etc... integration built into it. Of course if you go with that you will loose some of the features boxee now offers that plex does not yet (almost all the online content, hulu,netflix,etc...)

[Zenara25]

I use my ipod touch along with itunes to SYNC my video podcasts (So I can continue where I left off on my ipod touch).
I'm not going to move to Boxee to view podcasts or audio podcasts until this is an option.

Hope this happens.

I still love watching Hulu and Netflix on Boxee though.

[different computers]

I love Boxee but don't use my music in it because there is no support for playlists.

Airtunes support would be the real piece de resistance.

[rizwank]

Perhaps integrating/including Plex's Media Server?

http://elan.plexapp.com/2008/11/15/plexseven-introducing-the-all-new-plex-media-server/

[BumblebeeMan]

I am using Boxee or VIDEO MANEGEMENT only.
BOXEE's mp3 manegement sucks! MOST of my songs are wrongly recognized. I keep using iTunes for that.

I think that an OPTION for manual (or idtag imported) metadata is something HIGHLY needed, not only for the music part, but for videos also.


I have over 800 artists in my library; Boxee finds almost half of them and labels about 10% of those incorrectly. :mad: I'm intimately familiar with my music collection, so why can't I make adjustments to it?

Also, what's with the lack of playlist support?

I'm eager to embrace Boxee, what with the spiffy hulu and netflix integration and the ease of navigation, but poor music support is going to make me switch back and forth between it and iTunes (songbird?)

[marcel]

one of the issues we will be working on in the future is a more robust way of indexing your music collection...

[Remulus]

I don't have problem if the music misses and i have to go in recognize manually. you only have to do that once. My problem is that there is so much i have that is not in the database or it is in the database and I say recognize and nothing happens. So that music is lost to the program.

and manually entering the name of the album artist is random sometimes. It will see it, i hit recognize, nothing happens, then i go back and it doesn't find it.

So it would be nice to have a better interface, click on artist, and then have it list albums, click and choose.

Most problems come with classical by the way since composer, conductor, etc are often listed differently on databases.

Maybe there is a way for someone to add manually to the database, like a wiki version in an alternate database. Only one person would have to upload a good ID3 tagged version and then everyone would have it.

In the meantime, what i have done is put all the music that it does not recognize into folder by type and go into the folders through Source directly with boxee to play them. It will do for now.

In the meantime i patiently await a fix and thank everybody for their hard work. I am sure it will get to perfection.

[busmasterdma]

I think integrating iTunes should be a very low priority for the developers.

If you do implement support at some point, PLEASE do not make it mandatory for users to import songs via iTunes.

Trust me, not all mac users use iTunes. As a Mac user, I find any application that requires an iTunes library to be very obnoxious.

[EdelRSX]

The things being discussed isn't a matter of iTunes integration or not if you really think about. Boxee has no reason to read (and should not read / edit) the iTunes library or the iPhoto library. I would imagine it probably isn't worth the time of the developers to make changes whenever apple makes changes to their internal formats.

However I suspect a simpler way would be to edit the information that iTunes uses to 'organize' itself; which is also utilized by just about every player out there. The id3 tags. I can drag the files from my ipod/itunes on a linux distro and RhythmBox/Amarok/Banshee/XKCD all recognize them properly. Same goes for Windows Media Player / WinAmp on windows.

Thats not to say we shouldn't use the internet to help assist us; but I would also imagine we might already or might find utilization of MusicBrainz to be effective; rather than reinventing another wheel that open source has already created for us. Although I realize that it only really helps for music.

If you have itunes and want to play music in itunes all the time; you're just going to keep using itunes.. or front row. I imagine most target machines for boxee aren't going to be your everyday computer or the machine you most frequently sync your iPod with but that's only a guess. (which has little impact on my main point)

[agentlame]

However I suspect a simpler way would be to edit the information that iTunes uses to 'organize' itself; which is also utilized by just about every player out there. The id3 tags.

the team already said they are switching to id3.

[Buckaroo]

not everybody... frankly, itunes is garbage.

i think it would be a huge mistake for boxee to default to itunes/iphoto/apple-anything... remember, boxee also runs on linux, and will run on windows.

the option might be a good idea... but not the default.

What HE said!

[EdelRSX]

the team already said they are switching to id3.

my bad must have missed that one

/me issues apology

:-)

Happy Holidays and keep up the great work!

[agentlame]

/me issues apology

Happy Holidays and keep up the great work!

no worries... happy holidays to you, also. :)